Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: Foreign.
[00:00:12] Speaker B: Come on.
[00:00:15] Speaker A: This is Outside the Round with Matt Burrill, a rage rowdy podcast.
What's going on, guys? Welcome back to another episode of Outside the Round with me, Matt Brill. Shout out to our good friends from Surfside. No bubbles, no troubles, Delicious vodka, iced tea, lemonade. All the good stuff today. Very, very, very special guest. A guy that I've been a huge fan of his music. I've been a huge fan of his podcast, 10 Year Town. He's got a new project, all the Rest EP, to kick off the ear. It's our man, Troy Cartwright. Brother, it is awesome to be sitting across from you, man.
[00:00:46] Speaker C: Hey, man, thanks for having me, dude.
[00:00:48] Speaker A: Anytime. Like, huge fan of what you do, seriously. And, like, love the conversations that you have with different folks here in Nashville and folks that are in the music business and super stoked to have some new music coming out from you, man.
[00:01:01] Speaker C: Yeah, I'm pumped.
[00:01:02] Speaker A: How's it feel to have a project coming out to kind of start off. Start off the year?
[00:01:06] Speaker C: It feels great. You know, I've been working on this e, this, this record, this, so this ep, etc. All the rest is like a part of like a, you know, like a larger body of work. And yeah, I've been working on it for so long, like, literally years, to the point where I'm like, is this ever gonna happen? You know, I'm like, so in the weeds on this thing.
So for it to be kind of where it's at now and ready to be, you know, released into the wild, so to speak, it's really. It's really exciting.
[00:01:36] Speaker A: Yeah. What made you want to go for it now? Because I know 24 and pre. In previous years, you. You put out a lot of music in your time, bud. And 25, you. You put a little bit out there, but what is it about 2020?
I want to get songs out there.
[00:01:51] Speaker C: Yeah, that's a great question. So, you know, it's sort of a longer story, I guess, but I think, you know, my career has always had these, like, different. I don't know, it's like I started in Texas. That was like, one facet of my career. Then I moved to Nashville and I got signed, and that was like, one part of my career. And then I was sort of post label for the last four or five years, and that was, you know, a really great experience where I had all this freedom to, like, put out as much music as I wanted. Yeah, whatever was inspiring me.
And.
And I kind of got to this point when I was putting out my last project. Bygones. Where I was like, I really want to just, like, take a second because I've just been going, you know, like you said, I released. I think I released, like, 30 songs in, like, two and a half years or something.
And I really wanted to, like, take some time. And, like, I felt like I earned, like, the ability to take a. Take a little break and just, like, really think about what I wanted to do. Yeah. Next. And what I wanted to say, and.
And so I kind of had this idea where I wanted to, like, dig a little bit deeper and, like, get to make a project from start to finish with the whole record in mind, which is something I haven't somehow. Like, even though I've been doing this for so long, I've never really had that opportunity. It's always been sort of, okay, we got this song. Does this song go with this song? Let's just put these together. That sounds like a record.
[00:03:28] Speaker A: Just puzzle pieces.
[00:03:29] Speaker C: Yeah. This was the first time I really got to, like, sit down and go, what kind of world do I want to make?
And getting to sort of, like, pull out. The way that I think about it is there's just a giant chunk of marble that I've had, and I've kind of gotten to slowly chisel it. Chisel away at it. And so getting to kind of free this idea from the marble has just been, like, really rewarding. And I'm, you know, I'm really excited about it, and I'm really proud of it.
[00:04:00] Speaker A: Yeah. Are you still working with Aaron Es Hus?
[00:04:03] Speaker C: Yeah, with Aaron. Aaron did a couple songs on this record, and Brandon Hood did the other ones, and then the title track. Etc. All the rest was produced by Jason Massey.
[00:04:14] Speaker A: Nice.
[00:04:15] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:04:15] Speaker A: That's awesome, man. That's kind of one of the benefits to being in town so long. You kind of. You've been here so long that you. You have your guys and girls that you love. No date with, and they've grown over the years. Just like you have to. Where your whole process kind of marinates, man. And then it comes out of the oven exactly how you want it.
[00:04:32] Speaker C: That's. You know, who to use. It's like, I'm trying to make this dish, you know, the guy to call for that, you know?
[00:04:36] Speaker A: Yeah, man. So I want to back up to your Texas guy, but you went to Berkeley, so you spent some time up in New England. What was that like? Transitioning from Dallas, Going up. Going up to New England, man.
[00:04:47] Speaker C: It was great. You know, when I. When I was graduating high school, I was Just desperate to, like, get out, you know, I think I chose Boston because it was far. You know, I just wanted to try something different.
And. And it was. It was way different from growing up in Dallas. It was a culture shock for sure. And, you know, immediately I was not the best musician there at all.
And that was really, honestly, like, super beneficial to realize, like, oh, hey, the world doesn't revolve around you. Yeah. And. And if you want to be good at this, you're going to have to, like, put in a lot of work.
So I loved all. All of that education that I got musically. And then also, one of the cool things about being at a place like Berkeley is that it's really international.
And so you're just around people that aren't like you. I mean, that literally grew up in a completely different situation than you from people from all over the country and all over the world. And, like, you know, it was, I think, just, like, pretty foundational to me as a. As a human being, like, how I see the world or whatever.
[00:06:00] Speaker A: Yeah, man. Perspective is a huge thing. And to get that in your college years.
[00:06:04] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:06:04] Speaker A: Not a lot of people have that. You know, it's. It's so. And I think that helps you as a. As a creative with the songwriting process and this whole music thing of understanding how it works outside of living in Dallas, you know.
[00:06:17] Speaker C: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[00:06:18] Speaker B: And.
[00:06:18] Speaker C: And, you know, like, just.
Just growing up, you know, like you. I. I'd never drank a beer until I got to college, you know, that was a whole learning process.
[00:06:28] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:06:29] Speaker C: Just how to, like, conduct yourself, you know.
[00:06:32] Speaker A: Yeah, man.
[00:06:33] Speaker C: In the world. And so I was. I was. I learned a lot at Berkeley, for sure.
[00:06:37] Speaker A: Yeah. And Boston, like you said, it's just a whole different world. Like, I'm a New York guy, so I grew up about 30 minutes outside New York City. Went to college in New Jersey. Spent a lot of my time before I moved here about eight years ago. Yeah. Living in the Northeast and Boston is just such a different vibe. Like, the culture of people up there. Like, you still have that blue collar kind of feel to it, but it's an exciting place I'm sure to spend.
[00:07:00] Speaker C: Oh, yeah, it's great. And we went to. We would. We would go to New York, like, all the time. It's just.
[00:07:05] Speaker A: Everything's just a train right away.
[00:07:06] Speaker C: Yeah. We took the. I don't know if you ever. If it was still running, we would take, like, the Fungal bro.
[00:07:13] Speaker A: The Phong Wa bus. You're taking me back.
[00:07:15] Speaker C: It was like. It was like 25. It drop you off. It pick you up, like, in like, South Station in Boston and drop you off in Chinatown in New York. And I think pretty soon after I moved, they, like, had to shut it down because I think it was, like, really unsafe.
[00:07:33] Speaker A: Yeah, it was. I. Buddy, I never experienced the fung. I had buddies that would kind of take it for the. For the bit or to go see buddies that were up in New England.
[00:07:42] Speaker C: I mean, it was cheap. Dude, one time I was on there and there was just like a lady with a live chicken.
[00:07:47] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:07:47] Speaker C: And I was in, like, that. No, no one was phased by this.
[00:07:52] Speaker A: Yeah, man, the phone wa. Bro, I haven't talked about the fungal in a while, bro. That takes me back, man. Yeah, frequent.
[00:08:01] Speaker C: Frequent writers of the phone, for sure.
[00:08:03] Speaker A: Yeah, man. And getting to travel to a New York or a Philly, just that proximity of getting to enjoy culture. Totally.
[00:08:11] Speaker C: And yeah, I loved all that stuff. And, you know, you had friends from, you know, all over and, you know, you didn't, you know, you weren't worried about, like, getting a nice hotel. It was just like, does somebody have a couch? Yeah, it's like a friend of a friend of a friend that said you could stay there. You don't even know if it's legit or not.
[00:08:28] Speaker A: Yeah. Bunking up with your buddy that's in, like, Williamsburg or Astoria or one of those spots where the young college age kids can afford to actually be in New York. So when did you get out here to Nashville?
[00:08:37] Speaker C: So I. After college, I moved back to Dallas and I really. So, you know, my dream originally going to college is I wanted to move to New York and, like, work in the music business.
And I did an internship in New York in college and, like, quickly realized that I didn't want to, like, be in the actual business like I thought I did. Yeah, Like, I wanted to be an artist and not do, you know, like, accounting, which is basically what my internship was, was like royalty accounting.
[00:09:15] Speaker A: A lot of numbers, man.
[00:09:16] Speaker C: Yeah, but. But I. But I really credit that with, like, lighting a fire under me going, if you're gonna do this, you're gonna need to, you know. Yeah, like, get to work. And, like, it's not my plan, you know, this wasn't a good plan, was like, oh, well, I'll work in the music business, I'll meet the right people, and then I can break in that way. And I just realized, like, there was a lot of separation of, like, church and state between, like, people in the business and, like, the people making the music yeah.
So I. When I graduated college, I was.
I was doing a lot of different stuff to just, you know, get by. I was like walking dogs in Boston. I was singing in weddings, playing gigs, you know, and I realized that if I wanted to like, be doing original music, I probably needed to go back to Texas just because it was cheaper.
I could like move in with my parents for a little bit and like, kind of just start at the bottom and work my way up. Whereas, like, when I was in Boston, like, I was having to do so much stuff.
[00:10:24] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:10:25] Speaker C: Just to like pay rent. So I knew I was like, if I really want to dedicate all my time to writing songs and doing original music, like, I need as much time as I can possibly find. Yeah.
[00:10:36] Speaker A: And there's a scene in Texas absolutely
[00:10:39] Speaker C: huge, which was a huge part of it. I had a. I had like my. An old drum teacher that played drums for this Texas singer songwriter named Max Stalling. And I just kept up with him over the years and I sent him some songs and he was like, I think they'd like this down here. And like, in hindsight, he didn't totally know. He just said it. And I took it as like, gospel fact. Like, they're gonna love me down there. I'm gonna move home.
So I.
I moved back to Dallas and I just, you know, I moved in with mom and dad, which was strange. That felt like a massive step backwards. But it was in pursuit of, of the dream, you know, and.
And I just started playing, man. I started playing coffee shops and I was writing. I wrote every day at 11. Like I would just. I just treated it like a job. No one was paying me, but every day at 11 I'd write, started playing shows.
Would kind of like was kind of playing through the video game Guitar Hero where like I started in the coffee shop and then I moved to. Up to like the local bar. Yeah. You know, this place called Eight Air Saloon. Shout out to Joel and they would let you play a four hour set, but you could play originals and you got like 20% of the bar tab. So that was the goal. It was like, all right, I got to get all my friends to come see me play.
And you learn so much about what of which songs of yours work and which covers. Kind of like keep the people there. It was like a real education.
And then from there started getting gigs in Austin and Lubbock and you know, you're just slowly expanding the. The network or whatever. And I met, man, I met a lot of guys, like early on met Kleto from Flatland.
[00:12:33] Speaker A: One of the best humans you could possibly meet in the world. Yeah.
[00:12:36] Speaker C: Truly the best guy. And me and him and Parker McCollum and Randall King, we were all in a, like, a songwriter competition in Stephenville, Texas. Larry Jo Taylor songwriting competition.
And that's how I met those guys was just from doing that. And that was.
That was like dinner. It might have been like 12 years ago now.
[00:13:03] Speaker A: Wow.
[00:13:04] Speaker C: And, you know, we've all. It's just kind of crazy how, like, over time, it's like, oh, wow. That was. That was a kind of like a stacked songwriter competition.
[00:13:13] Speaker A: Yeah, I'd say so, man. I'd say so.
[00:13:16] Speaker C: Yeah.
And.
Yeah, so I just was making records and, like, doing the thing, you know, I had absolutely no clue what I was doing. I was in a GMC Yukon, driving all over, you know, and just playing shows wherever, whoever would have me. And we played some weird ones and we played some great ones. Yeah.
And I was very, like, entrepreneurial minded.
I didn't.
I didn't have a manager or a booking agent for. Dude, for real, for so long. Like, I was playing like 100 shows a year, and I just couldn't.
I was. I couldn't find. I couldn't find anybody to help me. And it really tore me up, man. It made me feel like it's like, okay, am I not legit? Yeah. You know, and that was like a great lesson that I learned because all that stuff, like, totally worked itself out, you know? But I think a lot of people get, like, hung up on, like, well, I need this person to make it. And, like, you don't just do it
[00:14:23] Speaker A: yourself, especially as your buddies are starting to get all that.
[00:14:26] Speaker C: Totally, dude.
[00:14:27] Speaker A: Which is the. One of the hardest things about this whole music business and being a songwriter and being an artist is your buddy will get a publishing deal and it's like, well, where's mine? Or your buddy will have a manager, no doubt, for him, or a booking agent or a label or something. And. Yeah, it's knowing that your time is gonna come and just keeping after it like you did.
[00:14:46] Speaker C: Yeah. Yeah, man. It's the. The comparison stuff. Like, it's hard, but. But over time you realize, like, it's all good. And if somebody else is, like, starting to get some heat or some action or whatever that looks like, it's like, that's. That's good. That's good for everybody.
[00:15:05] Speaker A: High tides raise all ships.
[00:15:07] Speaker C: Totally. And. And those people are your friends, like, the whole time. That's the other part. You don't realize Is like the friendships that you make along the way, dude. That's. It's literally the whole point.
[00:15:18] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:15:19] Speaker C: You know, it's. It's all about the ride and whatever. All the good stuff, records that you sell or cool shows that you play. It's like that stuff's cool, man. But like, it's the people you're doing it with that really. That really like make it worthwhile. Yeah.
[00:15:33] Speaker A: I was saying this in a Red Door conversation with a kid, which I have a lot of those hosting events in town, Even though I'm 10 years off the booze. It's like I spend a lot of late nights at Red Door still with the kids that are new to town. And I tell them this whole thing is about creating cool things with you, your friends.
[00:15:47] Speaker C: That's it, man.
[00:15:48] Speaker A: That's really what this is. When you realize that it's that which is helpful at a young age. So a lot of guys and girls can. They. People still do it where you can make a whole career and make a whole living just staying in Texas. So what prompted the leaving the Lone Star State to come out here?
[00:16:04] Speaker C: Well, I never thought I would leave.
[00:16:05] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:16:06] Speaker C: And I had started getting some traction around this. This EP I made called Don't Fade.
And I had a radio promoter that was doing like Texas radio.
And she knew a guy in Nashville that was a publisher and she was like, you should meet this guy. You should just go up there and. And I had some friends in Nashville. So, you know, you don't like need a ton of excuses to go to Nashville, but. Because I'd never really been before to Nashville, so came up here and I met this guy and.
And he took a meeting with me and I played him some songs and he was like, that's cool, man. You know, and you're like, so do I get a record? Like, you know, you don't know how it works.
[00:16:54] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:16:56] Speaker C: And he very night. It was very nice of him. He set me up on a few co writes and I'd never really done that before.
And I came back a couple months later and I had my first co write and it was with this guy, Clint Daniels, who's like a legend and an amazing human. And I have no idea why whatever they said to talk him into writing with me was a good sales job on their part. But we wrote and then afterwards he took me to Red Door, of course, and it was probably like 3pm and he's like, all these people here are songwriters. And I couldn't believe it, like that. I didn't know that there were other people that were, like, messed up the same way that I am, you know, and introduced me to all these songwriters, and I was just. I was hooked, man. I was like, this is.
This is it. Because it's. You know, it's.
Doing it in. In Texas is, like. Was so great, but Dallas itself was, like, a little bit lonely in terms of, like, just having people to write songs with. There wasn't. There's not, like, a ton of infrastructure around songwriting, and I'm sure. I think it's getting better now. But it was.
Yeah, it was just like, okay, so I can just show up here and, like, all these people hang out in these places and write songs, and this is a real job. Like, are you kidding me?
So pretty soon after that, I, like, found a way to. To come to Nashville, you know?
[00:18:35] Speaker A: Yeah, man.
[00:18:35] Speaker C: And that's how I got here.
[00:18:36] Speaker A: Hey, man, it's just. It blows. It blows the mind of, like, the abundance of creators that are here and of song. Yeah.
[00:18:43] Speaker C: You know, and, like, you kind of need a little bit of, like, delusion to do it, because everybody is so good, you know? I think if I knew everything that I knew now, like, I might not have had the guts to do it.
[00:18:58] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:18:59] Speaker C: But. But it was just.
I didn't know any better, and I just jumped in, you know, and. And went. Jumped all the way in and got in way over my head, but.
But, you know, I learned a lot, and. And it worked out, so. Yeah, man.
[00:19:15] Speaker A: It definitely, definitely did. And what year would that have been that you moved out?
[00:19:18] Speaker C: So that was.
It's. So. It's. I really should have the date. It was sometime in the summer of 2016. I actually don't remember.
[00:19:29] Speaker A: What a time to move here, too.
[00:19:30] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:19:30] Speaker A: What was going on in the city at that time?
[00:19:33] Speaker C: And I was so. And I was.
I was touring like crazy in Texas. So, like, I don't even remember.
I know my lease ended in Dallas in May, and I drove some stuff up here, and I remember flying, like, every Thursday I was flying back, and every Monday, I was flying back to now. You know, it was. It was very chaotic.
[00:19:55] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:19:55] Speaker C: And then.
Yeah, sometime like, a year after that, I. I got, like, an actual publishing deal and, you know, was able to sort of, like, figure out, like, okay, we're getting good rights now. We can, like, focus on this a little bit. Yeah, man.
[00:20:09] Speaker A: It was 2016. I think, of two big. I mean, there were a lot of great events, like what we do in town now, but I think of, like, that Being one of the. Hey. Of Whiskey Jam. Really. Ward and. And. And Josh and those guys really getting that going. And then I think of revival over at Timmuth back in the day. Why not? Wednesday was another great one. Threesome Thursdays, like, there were some. What a time to be new in town.
[00:20:32] Speaker C: Oh, it was the best. And that's how you met all. Met all my friends at Whiskey Jam. You know, I mean, and. And I think that was the summer that the Preds were, like, made that deep playoff. Yeah.
[00:20:43] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:20:43] Speaker C: And because I remember you'd go to the Whiskey Jam, like, outdoor party.
[00:20:49] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:20:49] Speaker C: The Losers parking lot would have the game on.
[00:20:51] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:20:52] Speaker C: And then people would play. I. I think that's the first time I saw Morgan Wallen play.
[00:20:56] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:20:58] Speaker C: And.
Yeah, dude, it was. It was a magical time. And of course, had no idea. Just thought this was like, what every day is like.
[00:21:06] Speaker A: Yeah.
Yeah, man. And it's like that. That sense of community of those years, because I got here 2018, so I was like, at the right. In kind of that middle ballpark of just. You went out during the week, and then you went and watched your buddies play or made new friends that were playing, and then you'd go to Losers and listen to the band, and then you go to Red Door, and it was just like. That was.
[00:21:27] Speaker C: That was the.
[00:21:28] Speaker A: Was a scene, man. And then going to revival on Tuesdays was like an institution. Like, was a big deal when. When a buddy of yours was playing on that pew.
[00:21:37] Speaker C: Yeah, man.
[00:21:38] Speaker A: You know, Absolutely. Special times, man.
[00:21:40] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:21:40] Speaker A: And like I said, I love your music, but I also love what you're doing with. With ten years out. Oh, man, it is one of my favorites. You're over 100 episodes now, which is got to be an unbelievable feeling. But talk about where your mind was with getting that started.
[00:21:57] Speaker C: Well, I think I had been making so much content as, like, an artist, and I was really getting, like, a bit burnt out on, like. I don't know how to describe this. It was sort of, you know, like, people understand if you're making a TikTok every day. It's like you do it for a couple of years. You're like, boy, I like. I don't know.
I don't know if this is doing as, like, what I want it to be doing.
[00:22:26] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:22:26] Speaker C: But I really loved, you know, I understood the power of, like, content and making stuff, and I was trying to find a way to sort of just like, still be consistent with that kind of stuff, but, like, elevate the conversation.
And I really have A deep passion and respect for the craft of songwriting. And I just figured, like, there's got to be a way to, like, talk to people about this, you know, and make a podcast. Because what. What was happening is, like, you know, you go, right. You go do a right, and you spend the first 30 minutes talking to somebody because you haven't met them before, and, you know, you're just kind of getting their. Their story.
And I knew that that would be a really interesting podcast. Yeah.
But I didn't totally know how to do it. And I thought about it for a long time and, you know, was trying to find, like, the perfect name. And one night, me and my wife, we. We have, like, a kitchen table in our house, and we talk most nights there and just, like, you know, try and, like, figure. Solve all the world's problems, basically.
[00:23:33] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:23:34] Speaker C: And one night she said, like, oh, your podcast should be called Ten Year Town. And it's like, oh, of course.
And then after that, it was, like, within a month or two. Like, it. You know, somehow once we had the name, it was, like, easy to, like, get it going. Yeah. And then I had to just convince all my buddies to, like, come on. And it was felt, like, super uncomfortable. You know, first few episodes, you're like, hey, will you, like, come do this thing that I'm in no way qualified to do?
Try it.
[00:24:06] Speaker A: Will you sit here, talk with me into a microphone while we record it on camera?
[00:24:09] Speaker C: Yeah. Yeah. So Benji Davis was the first. First episode.
[00:24:14] Speaker A: Great episode to start with, by the way.
[00:24:15] Speaker C: Yeah. And then actually we had to redo it because I wasn't. I was so bad. So I think Jimmy Bell ended up being our first episode. I can't remember if it was him or Benji.
[00:24:24] Speaker A: I think. I think it was. I think Jimmy was episode one, because I was looking.
[00:24:26] Speaker C: I was scrolling back before this, and, yeah, I had to. I. Like, a month later, I was like, benji, can you come do it again? Like, I got so much better for, like, the first time.
[00:24:35] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:24:35] Speaker C: The fourth time I did it or whatever.
And so, yeah, started out with me just asking my friends and talking about songwriting, which. Which I love because I feel like people from the outside looking in, like, you know, I. My hope is that people can have a better understanding of the journey that the songwriter takes and, like, place more value on the craft of songwriting. Because I. I do see a lot of things that make me nervous for the future of songwriting, and I just hope that it helps people, like, understand how valuable and special it is. And this little, small, little ecosystem within the music industry, like, deserves to be celebrated and deserves to be, you know, protected because we. We're facing, like, a lot of, you know, headwinds, and. And there's a lot of really smart people trying to figure it out, and ultimately it'll be fine. But, you know, hopefully this helps everybody understand it a little bit better.
[00:25:41] Speaker A: Yeah, man. And I love how in depth the conversations get. Like, for me, some of my favorite episodes have been. The Steven Wilson Jr. Episode was incredible, man. And I had him on here a few years back, like, when he was just starting to go out there with the Brothers Osborne guys and, like, just starting to kind of get music out there. Like, I think 1994 just come out, you know, and to see what he's done. But listening to him tell his story. Hardy said some incredibly inspiring things on his episode. You just had Isaac from 49 Winchester on. Big fans of them as well. And even listening to the career writers like the J.T. hardings of the world, you know, offered a lot of insight.
[00:26:18] Speaker C: Yeah, man, it's. It's really.
It's. They're all. All those guys that you mentioned, they're all just, like, really special. Yeah. I mean, that's the thing. It's like everybody has a story, and to get. To get to tell it is like, I. I feel like it's a really an honor to me.
[00:26:33] Speaker A: Yeah, man. It's an awesome platform to have, and I'm sure. Has there been a crossover from people finding the podcast into checking out your music?
[00:26:42] Speaker C: Yeah, yeah. You know, it's. It's interesting, like, how it sort of ebbs and flows. I think when I started the podcast, I was like, you know, really known for being an artist at the time. Yeah. And, yeah, now I see people popping up on some stuff. I post my artist stuff. They're like, are you the guy from 10 year town? You know, and so hopefully it all gels together into, like, you know, one giant thing that, like, helps show people who I am and, like, what I can do and. Yeah, man, you know, I get. I enjoy that.
[00:27:18] Speaker A: Yeah, you talked about. You touched on a little bit earlier, but coming here and then working your way up and having the label deal and then going from. Have starting out independent and then having the label deal for a while and then going back to that square one of being independent. What was that period of time like and getting back to doing the independent thing?
[00:27:40] Speaker C: Yeah, you know, it was. It was.
It was like, quite painful at the time, for sure. You know, it was like, very disorienting. I think there was a lot of fear involved just from the standpoint of, you know, you make a lot of friends and your, you know, your peers, your songwriting peers, and they're riding with you because your record deal and they hope that you can go to the radio and take their song to radio. And so like, when all of that sort of suddenly goes away, there's, you know, a fear that. Are these people even my friends?
[00:28:18] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:28:19] Speaker C: You know, and that's a lot to navigate. You know, just mentally, I think it was. It was like a, you know, it was filled with a lot of landmines, I guess, that I was having to walk through and.
But ultimately it was like, what, am I gonna do something about it or am I just gonna give up? You know, and fortunately I just did what I always do, which is like, all right, I just gonna have to grind and work hard. And I was able pretty quickly to like, get some music out that I had been excited about and just for whatever reason, couldn't put out on the label at the time and started releasing that stuff independently and. And it actually started working like pretty much immediately, which was of course vindicating.
[00:29:13] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:29:13] Speaker C: You know, and a relief.
And.
And gave me a lot of room to kind of like try different stuff because, you know, it was when you start to have success, like, you know, you have some money coming in and you can kind of like take more chances, which to me is just always been the goal. It's. I just want to make stuff. Yeah. So if. As long as I can keep making stuff, it's all good.
[00:29:40] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:29:41] Speaker C: You know, but. Yeah, man, it was, it was, it was a wild. It was a wild ride. And I feel like I really.
As painful as is going through that was like I learned so much about myself. Yeah. And how resilient I can be, you know, like people talk about being resilient like it's a, you know, like it's a superpower or like a skill set you can develop, but like, you don't really know if. If you are until you have to be. Yeah. If that makes sense.
[00:30:18] Speaker A: No, it makes total sense. But when your back's against the wall, what are you going to do?
[00:30:21] Speaker C: Yeah. Like, you find. You find things out about yourself that you never knew and when. So when I look back at that time, like, you know, I'm. I'm generally full of self loathing about myself, but when I look back on that time, like I. I'm really proud of. Of me, you know, and that I was just able to like, you know, make it through and kind of, like, somehow, like, thrive in that environment and then get to, like, get to where I'm at now, which is, like, just making stuff that I've always dreamed of making and. Yeah. You know, and I don't have to, like, ask anybody's permission. I just get to do it.
[00:31:07] Speaker A: You're the boss. Yeah, you're the boss. I always try to bring that up when. Especially when I get, like, the young kids that just moved here. I tell them, like, you're the CEO. You know, you're. You're bringing on partners for your product.
[00:31:19] Speaker C: That's right. You know, that's right. And, you know, I think I learned a lot, too. Just about, like, it's so, you know, people will, you know, burn you in this business and. And you can let yourself be fueled by rage and, like, revenge or whatever you want to call it. But, like, you know, it's a pretty toxic fuel. Yeah. So I think, you know, if it's what you need to get through, sure, use it. But, like, eventually you got to find, like, a.
Like a better fuel source, you know, something that can, like, sustain you for a longer period of time.
[00:31:56] Speaker A: What have been some of those fuel sources for you?
[00:31:59] Speaker C: I think I have, like, a tremendous amount of gratitude for literally, like, getting to make music and understanding that there is so much that is not up to me when I write a song.
Like, I don't get to choose what happens to the song. You know, if I'm. If. If another artist is going to cut it or if. If I'm gonna put it out.
All of that stuff is stuff that will happen.
But trying to realize that, getting to make it that day, in that moment, like, that's it. That is the whole thing. And. And if you can find the joy and just getting to make it, you. That, like, that will sustain you. That will. That will, like, make you better and make you so much more appreciative of everything because you're not worried about what happens to it. It's like, I did it. I made it. That's like, that's it, you know, and that is really, you know, helped improve my. My outlook.
[00:33:10] Speaker A: Yeah, man. No, it makes total sense. And you talk about being a songwriter and wondering if it's gonna get cut, and you've had Lee Bryce, Nickelback, Cody Johnson, Ryan Hurd, Josh Abbott Band, a bunch of others.
What's it like when you have somebody else? When you have somebody cut that song and you get to hear that finished product and especially, like, a Lee Bryce, like, yeah, like Kill the man or a band like Nickel.
That's gotta be sick.
[00:33:33] Speaker C: Yeah, dude, it's just an honor. It is. It's.
It's always, like. Doesn't feel real. My fir. My first, like, big cut, I guess, from, like, a major label artist was Ryan Herd. And I just remember getting a text from him, you know, and it was like, maybe Ryan Hurd. And it was like, 2am and I was at Basement east or somewhere over there, and he was just like, I love this song. Are you gonna cut it? And I was like, I need to respond to this tomorrow.
[00:34:05] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:34:08] Speaker C: And, yeah, I hit him back the next day. I was like, man, like, I love this song, but if you love it, you should put it on your record. And he did. And, you know, you're like, that's. Dude. Like, I came to town looking up to Ryan. Yeah. And the music that he makes and his artistry. So for him to. To put it on his record, that was, like, such an honor.
[00:34:30] Speaker A: That put that.
[00:34:31] Speaker C: That kind of stuff just really puts some wind in your sails, you know?
[00:34:33] Speaker A: Oh, I bet. I bet that next, right, you go in after finding out about that cut, well, you just.
[00:34:38] Speaker C: You're like. You feel like you belong. You're like, all right, this isn't all some elaborate joke that's happening to me. This is, like, actually real.
And it's the dude. It's the same way every time. Like, I. I have such vivid memories of, like, every song that's gotten cut. I think the.
The Cody Johnson cut.
Wished it was you. I was going to New Orleans for a bachelor party, and Hardy's wife, Callie, was randomly on my flight. So I'm. I'm sitting there, and. And. And she, like, somebody taps me, and I look up, and it's her, and she turns her phone around. She's like, I'm listening to your song. Wished it was you. Hardy just sent it to me, and I was like, huh, that's pretty cool. You know? And. And Hardy's my buddy, and he. I wrote it with. With Zach Aubin, who writes for Hardy. And by the time I had landed, I'm on a group text with Hardy and Zach and Benji, and it's like, Cody Johnson loves the song. He's gonna cut it.
And, like, you know, I mean, that didn't feel real at all.
So it was.
It was just super special, you know? And, like, you can't. Like, every time that happens, it's like you just pinching yourself.
[00:36:01] Speaker A: Yeah, I'm sure it's a feeling that never gets old. How do you decide? Because there's art, there's guys that write those songs that get buzz in town that people want to cut, they end up holding on to. And sometimes that makes them like, great Example right now is Kenny Whitmire. Kenny Whitmire wrote that has just put out Gave her the Moon. And that was a song that was being pitched around at labels all over the place, and he decided to hold on to it. And it's giving. It's putting a light on him that deserves to be shined on him and getting him all kinds of opportunities held onto it. Then there's other guys that end up holding on, and then sometimes it doesn't work out, and they probably kick themselves being like, damn, I should have let a. I should have let an Aldean or a Luke Bryan or a Combs or Wallen or somebody have that. So what's that decision process? Like, giving up one of your babies?
[00:36:46] Speaker C: Yeah, yeah, for sure, man. And sometimes you really got to look in the mirror and like with. With Wished It Was yous, that Cody Johnson song, it was. There were a few other artists, I think, that had put it on hold or. Or had taken a copy or whatever, and I, I. It didn't feel right. And when I heard that Cody was going to cut it, it was like, it felt right. I don't know how to describe it. It's just. You can tell. And I think with my own music, some songs, I just know if I feel like I have to tell the story or like I'm not gonna be able to continue, you know, then I'll, you know, I'll hold on to it.
And I've got a few, you know, sometimes I get in a fight with my publisher about it. It's like, really ought to pitch a song. I'm like, you can't. That's my song. It just is, you know, so you try and navigate that as best you can. But, man, when I know when they're good, when it's a really good one, you know it, you're like, yeah, I don't know what to do here, you know, but it's motivating anyway in a way also because you hope, hey, I hope somebody huge cuts this song. If not, I'll cut it. Yeah. You know, and then maybe if I want to cut it and somebody huge wants to cut the song, I'm like, all right, I gotta, like, I gotta do this justice. I gotta become a better artist and work harder and, like, elevate myself. So I'm like, worthy of singing it, you know, and it's got to be
[00:38:15] Speaker A: full circle for you as a Texas guy to have one of the guys that's waving the Texas flag around the world.
[00:38:20] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:38:21] Speaker A: And Kojo, I'm sure you remember when he was coming up, too.
[00:38:23] Speaker C: Absolutely, man. And. And, like, he's, you know, so, like, obviously he's incredibly successful. Somehow. He'd, like. I feel like he doesn't get enough credit. He's such an amazing entertainer.
Really, like, nice guy.
Very. You know, all the things that you would imagine about him, like, are true.
[00:38:45] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:38:45] Speaker C: He does what he says, and when he. When he cuts your song, like, it's all. The process is very smooth. So with some artists, they'll cut your song, and you're like, are they. Is it even going to make the record? Like, with Cody, it's always very, like, straightforward and, you know, you kind of know where you stand.
[00:39:03] Speaker A: Yeah. So that's awesome, man. What do you like, doing when you're not doing music? Like, how do you keep the balance? Because you're. You're a songwriter, an artist, a husband, a. A podcast host. Like, you have a lot of stuff going on, man. Like, how do you keep it all kind of on the. On. How do you keep the train on the tracks?
[00:39:21] Speaker C: Yeah, that's a great question. I really just.
I'm, you know, I'm by nature, like, a pretty disorganized person.
I think that, like, surprises people because I do a lot all the time, but, like, I just kind of, like, every day is tornado, and I'm just like, I don't know. This is what I'm doing today. But as far as, like, what I do to relax, I mean, I.
For the most part, man, I just, like, play music. I mean, I love it so much, and I like to read and. And, like, study and listen to records. And I'm really into kind of, like, some of the philosophy behind art, and I've been kind of, like, digging into that a little bit more and been talking about that a little bit on the podcast. But, you know, I'm just, like, trying to find the meaning of life, you know, and, like, how if that's through a song or through a book on philosophy or through looking at birds, you know, and taking a walk, like, whatever it is, I just. I've really try and, like, find a way to stay present, and I feel like I'm in this phase of life where everything's happening really fast, and I'm just, like, kind of almost digging my heels in, like, trying to slow down And.
And just, like, enjoy it.
[00:40:42] Speaker A: Yeah, man. We get one life.
[00:40:44] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:40:44] Speaker A: We get one shot at doing this. So it's enjoying those moments, like you said, being present, that's something that me and Nick with. With the Razor Audi stuff have to do. And we're running around like tornadoes as well. You know where it is. I have that ADHD complex where it's like, I almost do better in chaos. Like, the structure. Structure kind of scares me sometimes.
[00:41:04] Speaker C: Yeah. You know, and, I mean, you got to be careful. Like, when. When I'm on the road is the. It's the best, because the only thing I got to do that day is get from Kansas City to Omaha, you know, and you feel such a sense of accomplishment when you're on the road, but, like, day to day, you don't. You don't have that. And you have to make sure you're, you know, staying on top of things as much as you can. And, like. Yeah, with making the record, it's just been like, really?
I feel like part of the reason it's taking so long is just because I'm like, it. There's nobody asking me about it except for me, if that makes sense. You know, like, if I. If I slack off today, then I'm just a day further away from it happening. Yeah. So, like, staying locked in is, like, part of. Part of the.
Part of what makes it happen. Yeah.
[00:41:59] Speaker A: So what are you hoping people feel when they listen to all the rest and they listen to part one of this. This bigger project that's gonna be coming at us later this year?
[00:42:06] Speaker C: So a lot of my favorite records kind of give a. A, like, a sense of place.
If you think about, like, Southern accent, Tom Petty, or, like, Nebraska with Bruce Springsteen. Like, I have always loved those records. And when I made this record, I, I. I had a place in mind which was like, it's. It's this place out in West Texas that some of my family is from and, like, where I used to go when I was a kid and, like, when I. I have this, like, weird reoccurring dream where I'm, like, I'm out there in West Texas and I. And I just love that place. I love the way that it feels. Feels how open it feels.
And.
And I had always wanted to do that, and I just never could quite figure it out. I written a few songs kind of around this character that inhabits that world.
And when I. When I made this record, like, I sat down, I was like, all right, I've got to. I've got to do this. I've got to, like, set this guy in my head free. This character that I have. I've got to, like, I've got to build him a world.
And so that's what I tried to do. And we've tried to be really diligent with this project of, like, creating, you know, not. Not just the music, but, like, the songs, of course, and, like, the visuals for, like, we went out to West Texas to like, make a lot of the stuff, which was really fun and really difficult. You know, like, nothing about this record has been, like, easy, but I think that that might be what makes it great. Yeah. Yeah.
[00:43:57] Speaker A: That it's. That it's. It's been challenging you.
[00:44:00] Speaker C: It is challenging, Creator. It has challenged me more than anything I've ever done.
[00:44:03] Speaker A: Wow.
[00:44:05] Speaker C: And it's scary. You know, it's scary because you, like. I put a lot into this.
I hope people like it.
[00:44:12] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:44:13] Speaker C: But then I just go back to what we talked about earlier. It's like, man, getting to make this has been like, such an honor.
[00:44:20] Speaker A: You could still be walking dogs in Boston.
[00:44:23] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:44:23] Speaker A: You could be doing anything else. But the fact that you get to do what you want to do.
[00:44:28] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:44:28] Speaker A: And have that opportunity to bring that into the world and bring it to life, man. Yeah. That's something you. You can't take for granted and you got to be proud of every day.
[00:44:36] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:44:37] Speaker A: That's what keeps you going.
[00:44:38] Speaker C: That's right. That's right. Yeah. So I'm excited, man. Of course. You know, nervous and.
But I think, and. And as far as, like, I tried to throw a dart, like, I know that I'm.
I'm like hitting the bullseye as much as I can. So, like, beyond that, like, it's. It's not up to me. Yeah.
[00:45:01] Speaker A: So what. What made you choose the songs that are on all the Rest for, like, part one of the bigger project?
[00:45:06] Speaker C: Well, I'd always sort of envisioned this ep.
It basically, this started with that song, Etc, all the rest and Which I actually wrote like a few years ago. And I wanted to put it on a bunch of different records. And it was always like, no, you can't put this out yet, because you don't.
It's part of a world and you haven't made the world yet. So if you just put this out there, it's not gonna, like, mean enough.
So I was really challenging myself to like. Yeah. Make sonically and song wise, like, make a body of work that could, like, support this song.
And.
And so, yeah, I just wrote and wrote and wrote and even cut some stuff that, like, isn't even gonna be on the record, but just trying to, like, get.
Get close. Get as close to the thing as I could.
And so, yeah, this has.
That's all right. And how missing you sounds, which is a new one that people haven't heard yet. It's like one of my. I love this song.
[00:46:19] Speaker A: Who'd you write that with?
[00:46:20] Speaker C: I wrote that with Brandon Hood and David Ray.
[00:46:22] Speaker A: Nice.
[00:46:23] Speaker C: And we were writing it.
We were out at the Castle in Franklin, and we wrote, like, most of a song. And then we got to the bridge and it started doing this thing, which you'll hear it's like, sounds like Old Town Petty. I'm one heart break away.
And that was the bridge. And I looked at Brandon, I was like, hey, dude, I hate to be that guy, but, like, this is the only part of the song that I care about. This is the chorus. So we have to redo the whole thing around this one part of the song.
And. And honestly, it was, like, super, super quick to, like, move it all around, but that was a really fun experience. And then cutting it with Brandon.
Brandon Hood is, like, an amazing producer, and he's, like, crushing it right now. He's doing, like, the Time Meyer stuff. Yeah.
A bunch of great records.
[00:47:18] Speaker A: We.
[00:47:18] Speaker C: We have been making this album since, I think, 2022.
[00:47:24] Speaker A: Wow.
[00:47:25] Speaker C: So just a little bit at a time, you know, we've done a few different studio sessions, and he's. He's been, like, a huge part of the process, and I'm. I'm incredibly grateful to him because it's. You know, it's taken a while, obviously, but that.
[00:47:39] Speaker A: It's almost better for it to have, like we talked about earlier, like, the time to marinate, you know.
[00:47:44] Speaker C: Totally, dude. Totally.
[00:47:45] Speaker A: You're not rushing anything.
[00:47:47] Speaker C: Yeah. And it's all very intentional. And like, we. This other song on. On the ep, the song called you've Got Away, we, me, Brandon and Billy Montana wrote that song, and Brandon did, like, a demo of it.
And, like, when I first got it, I was like, man, this cool song. But, like, not for the record, but, you know, six months go by, you're listening back to what you think the record is. And I'm like, well, hold on a second.
You drop that song in there and you're like, oh, my gosh. It's like it was supposed to be here the whole time.
[00:48:19] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:48:20] Speaker C: So having the. The time to get to really choose, like, what's going where and be intentional. And with the EP and with the album that you'll hear eventually. Like, it feels very I to me, anyway, feels incredibly cohesive and thought out and like the pacing of the whole record and all that stuff. So that's just been a dream that I've always had. I've always wanted to make a record like this and, you know, for one reason or another, just never had the opportunity. So to get to do it now is like. Feels really exciting.
[00:48:52] Speaker A: That's awesome, man. And as. As a consumer, as a fan, I can't wait. Like, I'm so pumped that you're. You're back. Like, 26 is a year of music for you.
[00:49:00] Speaker C: Yeah, man, absolutely. Yeah, I'm super pumped.
[00:49:03] Speaker A: So it's awesome. And then you talk about being on the road and do you still. Are you still out there doing. Doing that a bunch?
[00:49:08] Speaker C: Like, Yeah, a little bit. You know, kind of trying to find my way, I think is, you know, you've heard, like, times have changed, bro.
[00:49:19] Speaker A: Oh, I know, I know.
[00:49:21] Speaker C: It's.
It's a little different than it used to be. You know, whatever stuff like gas is expensive.
[00:49:28] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:49:29] Speaker C: Venues are. You know, there's a million reasons why touring is harder, but I also believe that it is, like, more important than ever. Yeah.
Just to get out there in the real world and like, connect with the fans. I mean, like, there's so much you can do on your phone. That's the trap. But my thing with social media at this point is, like, I think the jury is out on, like, how much of it is real.
You know, obviously there are real people watching the content. I can tell, like with my podcast that these are in fact not robots.
[00:50:07] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:50:07] Speaker C: But what percentage of them? I don't know.
[00:50:09] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:50:10] Speaker C: And when you are out on stage singing your songs to people, you. There's not. You can't replace that.
[00:50:18] Speaker A: The live experience is always going to be with us. That in person thing.
[00:50:22] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:50:22] Speaker A: And that's what is fortunate for us. With all these industries changing with technology, that live experiences is going to be craved more now and in the future than ever before.
[00:50:32] Speaker C: Absolutely. So I'm really, I'm trying to, like, be strategic and take my time and like find the right, the right partners and the right places to do it. But, like, that is a huge part of my plan for, you know, 20, 26 and beyond is like, doing that. And I'm excited to get back out there.
[00:50:53] Speaker A: That's awesome, man. Well, I can't wait to get out to a show. Yeah. Watch it, watch it out there, man. Be one of those folks out in that crowd. Man, thank you so much for coming on here, man. Like, seriously, you're someone that I've been talking about with Nick, where I'm like, I gotta get Troy on here, like, and keep doing what you're doing, man. Like, the podcast is so helpful to folks like myself that are, that are in the industry and here in this Nashville world, but for the people that aren't here that are, that are curious about what goes on and hearing people's deep stories, man. You have any other episodes coming? Like, any upcoming ones that you're super stoked about?
[00:51:25] Speaker C: Oh, yeah, man.
We got one with.
We just did Chris Blair from the Listening.
[00:51:31] Speaker A: Oh, nice.
[00:51:32] Speaker C: Incredible story. Yeah, we've got Lee Miller. Yeah, like, legendary songwriter, great dude.
[00:51:39] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:51:39] Speaker C: Wrote in color, you know, and yeah, we got. We got a bunch of stuff coming. So I'm, I'm pumped. And thank you, thank you for having me and thank you for the, the kind words about the music in the pod, dude.
[00:51:51] Speaker A: Of course, bro.
[00:51:52] Speaker C: Honored to be here.
[00:51:53] Speaker A: Of course, man. And pop out whenever you're free. Pop out to an event sometime and come hang, man, because we're, we're trying to showcase that live experience as well, because it is so important and it's such a big thing in the community, man. Well, y' all be sure to go check out our man, Troy Cartwright. All the rest the EP be on the red. Be on the lookout for the full picture. Go to West Texas with our man Troy. Project will be coming at full project to be coming out later on this year. But all the rest go straight stream that thing and check out the 10 Year Town podcast. Incredible pod. Learn so much on there. You get to hear some incredible stories and get to know more about Troy on there as well. Shout out to our friends from Surfside. No bubbles, no troubles. Check them out and get them wherever you get your booze. And for more on us, visit raisedratty.com from and Troy, I'm Matt Brill. This has been outside the round
[00:52:43] Speaker B: I never been account for st one place for too long I ain't never been the best at sin I love you to a girl I love only got a couple tricks up my sleeve they usually just make em leave so if you know me if you really know me you know I'm just a two trick pony but maybe the drinking and the lack of money for show I'm just a two trick pony yeah.
